Talk:Graves/@comment-68.38.212.180-20111023174317/@comment-4165869-20111024231928

I find Urgot to generally be far more tanky than Graves, since after a manamune and bruta, people actually build some defense on said crabman, rather than just stacking pure AD. Plus he has one of the biggest defense steroids in the game.

Anyways, to the points you actually brought up

1) Yes he's ranged. That kind of comes with having a gun. But, his 550 range just matches up with MF's, and barely out ranges Teemo, so it's not like he's sniping people from the same distance as Cait or Kog are.

2) Most ranged champions actually have a lot of ultility, if you look at their whole kit. Ezreal, Corki, Trist, Cait and Vayne all have a (over all) fairly spamable movement skills that causes them to jump/dash/roll a shot distance. A lot of ranged champions also have slows of some type (see MF, Cait, Ashe, Urgot ect). And the visions reduction on smokescreen isn't really all THAT great; it's a situational skill that will more often than not be a minor bother rather than a game changer. So honestly, Graves isn't really bringing anything all that new and ground breaking into the game utility wise, it's most doing the normal thing for a Ranged champion which is....

3) Damage. Ranged champions are generally called carries because their supposed to do most the damage come late game, and Graves does this well. Now I WILL admit that his Q can be a little insane in mid game when he comes back with a BF sword, or gets farmed/fed enough for an early BT.

4) Again, I tend to find Urgot, as well as Sivir, to be far tankier late game than Graves, on account of them actually itemizing for it. Yes, Graves' passive will help him a lot if your trying to 1v1 him, especially if your a squishy like the other team's carry, or a melee champion. But it does absolutely nothing for him when he has to run away, since if he can't stay in combat the stats vanish. Think of Graves of having a rageblade built into his kit; the longer he stays in combat, the harder it will be to kill him. But if you make him have to run from you, his passive is useless.