Talk:Ryze/@comment-87.161.172.203-20110228221558/@comment-67.208.160.122-20110317162702

"There are so many things wrong with this, like saying get 2 BV's." in response to OP's: "[thirdly] either another rod or MORE LIKELY SECOND BANSHEE"

Agreed. To the OP, it would better to get 2 Catalysts + 1 Glacial shroud rather than your recommended 3 Catalyst. This way, you can get your RoA and BV with your two Catalysts and a FH with your glacial shroud. At this point you would have Tear's (AA Staff, if upgraded), Boots of choice, RoA, BV, and FH. With these five items not only are stacked mana, you have survivability (HP, spell shield, Armor, MR). If the game isn't over by now, then your sixth item should be dependent on how the game is going. If they are stacking heavy on Magic Resist, get a Void or Abyssal. If they are not, then get another RoA or AA Staff.

The reason I think a second BV is useless is b/c not only the obvious fact that the passive spell shield is UNIQUE, but also because converting 3 Catalysts into 2 RoAs + 1 BV is way more beneficial than 1 RoA + 2 BV. Want the stats?

2ROA+1BV: 1735HP, 1825MP, 160AP, 50MR, Spell Shield/45s 1ROA+2BV: 1380HP, 1475MP, 80AP, 100MR, Spell Shield/45s As you can see, you take DRASTIC cuts in HP (by 455), MP (by 350), and AP (by 80) if you get the second option while only gaining +50MR. That additional MR from 2 BVs does not outweigh the benefits the from the 2 RoAs because IMO additional HP, additional mana and scaling added damage to his spells, and additional AP to further beef his spells are far more important for Ryze.

Lastly, I would strongly consider going only TWO catalysts (upgraded to RoA and BV) and one Glacial shroud (upgraded to FH) instead of three catalysts as you recommend; get a third catalyst only as your sixth/last item. Sure, two RoAs right off the bat sound like a good deal but IMO getting Frozen Heart before a second RoA is better. Sure, RoA may give more mana but FH gives three things that RoA does not: cooldown reduction, armor, and reduced AS debuff to enemies. All passive. You'll be casting faster, rocking not too shabby armor, and debuff the enemy squad with reduced AS -- all things you should get quickly to be useful in team fights; getting FH after any combination of 3 catalyst upgrades would be, imo, too late. RoA+BV+FH is a, imo, an essential item triumvirate for Ryze that is better than RoA+RoA+BV OR RoA+BV+BV because it makes your Ryze helluva' more well rounded with magic/armor res and CDR.