Talk:Veigar/@comment-24.79.79.17-20111231104356/@comment-90.48.30.143-20120102022428

Irelia is OP (not for her raw power, but because of her insane ability to farm, to get away, and to exterminate anything in split of second while being tanky if she's just a little tiny bit farmed or fed)

But indeed, veigar is really really good, but extremely hard to play, as you have no early game (you become potent around lvl 7 if you didn't had to back too much). At equal skill, any good mid can pubstomb you, as they just need to brain you with your stun (since it's one of the harder skill to land in the game)

You're also bad at "carrying" because a veigar often cannot make the game by himself because of his mechanics.

But goddamn you're fucking usefull for your team. You have both one of the greatest utility with your stun, and the ability to take out instantly fed squishy if you play well. His gank may also be very good, but at the same time you need to farm, it's his main draw back I think.

I would call him some kind of heavy AP support more than an AP carry. Cassiopeia can make the game by herself, veigar can just prevent her to do so.