Talk:Garen the Night of Demacia/@comment-3546228-20110816121312/@comment-98.252.26.207-20110830002041

Oh, that's right. I remember now. I was comparing the damage between the two for the price.

Your build, coming in at 15,770g with Last Whisper, ends up doing marginally more damage with marginally less effective health, but is ultimately much more vulnerable to magic and armor penetration and has virtually no CDR. I don't think the higher crit chance, and higher movement and attack speeds offset this, especially since my build uses Swiftness quints.

My build, coming in at 13,000g with Infinity Edge, only sacrifices 30% crit and 24 AD to get marginally higher defense that isn't nearly as vulnerable to armor/magic penetration. It's also cheaper, which means the game is less likely to end before it's finished.

You say don't underestimate crit on Garen, but is it worth spending 2,600g on it when only half of Judgment's damage crits? Is it worth building before Last Whisper? Absolutely not. Not in my opinion. If you ask me, your build is inefficient and has gaping holes in its defense.

One problem with your build is that you can't make room for more MR without sacrificing Last Whisper. This is one of those gaping holes. Last Whisper is not an after-thought on Garen, it really needs to be core, especially since it synergizes so well with Judgment.

I'll tell you: Don't underestimate the price difference between our builds. It matters big time, and if the game progresses to the point where you actually do end up with 16k gold, then you won't be doing much in the way of damage at all, and people will likely have 40% armor/magic pen, so the reduced CDR on Courage's active ends up adding more defense than anything else.

I'm of the opinion that Garen needs to defend first and attack second.

If you got melted with 180 armor and 152 MR, you either didn't have a tank, or were in a situation where you would've died regardless, rendering it a useless model upon which to base an opinion.

Your build has a lot less armor, and marginally less effective health, with no real CDR on Courage. Logically, your build will melt much more easily.

There are flaws in the way your build "builds", and easily exploitable holes in its defense. It costs a lot more gold, and all you're doing in the end is adding 30% crit and some attack speed.

I'm pretty sure you got my build wrong, or are using inappropriate test models, or not enough of them.