Talk:Riven/@comment-5077844-20141102214444/@comment-4834593-20141110182630

You just called Urgot an AD champ...

Really, does it take THAT long for everyone to realize that just because he was played bot lane TWO AND HALF A YEAR AGO, that doesn't mean he's currently not just a mana tank for the top lane that shits on melees like a swain and then puts the enemy AD carry (or whoever's fed) right into his team every teamfight (hint: Qss breaks the suppression, but doesn't stop the swap).

Either way, on shield scaling, Riven is the most offensive based champion in the game that has

1) No abilities (except ultimate) with more than 200-300 range

2) Has no dashes more than 325 range at once, which means she is slow when closing the gap, allowing aeons to flash, dash, blink or cc.

In fact I believe you can leave out "the most offensive based" for "the only"

Yes, she stacks CDR. I suppose you'll also have seen Rivens that didn't. And they failed. Because without CDR, Riven isn't useful. Riven needs CDR like Kassadin mana. Old Kassadin. It gives her shield a shorter cooldown, but only because without the shield, she WILL blow up before reaching the backline. Even WITH the shield, a Draven with sword of the divine can kill her faster than she can kill him. Own experience. Granted, it was on TT and therefore without GA and BT, but still.

And I just mentioned champions who have a shield... Because I was countering your argument of "hyperscaling" by showing you it isn't that amazing. Also, mana tends to not be a problem after laning phase.

And yes, she builds life steal. But currently, if you don't perfectly shield every single bit of poke in laning phase, your ONLY way to survival is delaying your core of Brutalizer and Tiamat (the AD part of RH) for a Vampiric scepter, and even that is sometimes not enough. I repeat, it was her form of sustain. It was meant to be comparable to Irelia and Yorick (well, weaker, but you get what I mean), not to a random caster minion.

Okay, so you mentioned most of the sustain champions and said they would get changed or reworked or whatever. Apart from being able to list more such champions (Cho'gath, Aatrox, Vladimir, Trundle, just to name a few), why would they be allowed to keep their sustain until rework while Riven wouldn't? Or do you agree with me Riven needs no major rework?