Talk:Twisted Fate/@comment-4124337-20150829030643/@comment-24586863-20150830210937

Ziggs is one of the few who can effectively counter TF, not the other way around. Ziggs and Annie can zone him out completely, Yasuo is just not funny, and Zed and Fizz go even with TF. As TF it is not your goal to beat your lane opponent, but to use superior wave clear to leave lane and gank. Even if TF is pushed under tower during laning, he can still get XP and be very useful once he hits 6, even with low cs.

And where his damage comes from? I did some maths on that, don't know by heart, I put it in my guide, but the AP scaling is insane, especially when you proc Lich Bane + W + E all together, followed by Q if they are still alive after that shot (which, late game, an ADC may not survive).