Talk:Udyr/@comment-25532677-20180618175249/@comment-7765731-20180624143600

A very good point. I've played some lanedyr and generally speaking, his kit focus is weird. They changed his Q to scale well with level and be somewhat effective even with fewer points in it - since it scales off total AD which in turn makes him more of a juggernaut - but his other (non-bear) abilities all need you to really focus your skill points into them to really make them effective. Because of this you feel it the most at level 9 and below - if you haven't put any points into turtle stance it is essentially pointless apart from sustaining between fights or as a quick swap for one hit before switching back to your leveled stance. The same goes for phoenix - if I'm not putting more than one point into it I have no reason to ever use it. If I feel I need to max turtle in a lane matchup, I put the one swappable point into Tiger, because Phoenix is useless with one rank in it.

To make him feel more like the other juggernaut's, I'd say they should make him a lot less skill point dependent for most of his abilities - Garen and Darius both effectively have one ability that is better maxing before the others in their Qs, but in general they scale off their levels more than their skill points while Udyr is the opposite - while he obviously scales with levels and needs them to get those skill points to begin with, all of his abilities outside of his Q pretty much NEED points focused into them to be useful. The baseline is very low. This can be achieved by switching base values from Turtle and Phoenix ability values into level/stat based values. Turtle shield would scale off maximum hp but have a much lower base and Phoenix stance would have it's damage values scale off levels more than ranks. This would fit him more into his juggernaut role and feel.

The end goal would be that in general his performance and output should be roughly the same, but in general his kit would feel better to play, especially in the niche that is lanedyr. These are just my thoughts, though. What are your (and others') thoughts, and do you agree?