Talk:Wukong/@comment-87.170.36.230-20110814215530/@comment-178.238.177.75-20110822013514

I'm going to comment a bit on what I can from your post: Any melee character can be kited easily by a ranged one. Udyr has no ranged attacks and is just as easily kitable if not more, yet he's an amazing laner. No slow? Neither does Warwick, you see anybody complaining? Very few melee champions have an actual escape mechanism (Jax, Jarvan, and lee Sin to name a few) and most others have very little more than a minor speed boost, yet they're still viable (heck Akali has an escape that has the same mechanics as Decoy except on a longer time frame, but much more blatantly obvious in skirmishes). Jarvan, Sion, and Rumble are 3 examples of champions without a heal or any other way to sustain themselves in lane, yet they can handle it just fine with the right amount of regen and lifesteal/spellvamp.

- Ratios are a bit bad I must admit. His Q has no scaling whatsoever (lol?) making it not much more than a simple debuff lategame. His E has 80% of bonus AD which is pretty bad comparing it to the likes of Irelia, Jarvan, or Lee Sin; however, keep in mind that its also an aoe gap closer which gives it a slight edge. Lastly, his W isn't really used for the damage. Heck the damage aspect can be completely removed and it wouldn't affect its usage much.

- His Q is an armor shredder, his W is a deceiving escape mechanism, his E is an aoe gap closer that gives him AS, and his R knocks up anybody it hits. How can you say "Skills nearly only do damage and not much more" with a straight face?!

- OK, he's no Alistar or Blitzcrank, but that's not his role. There are many champions with only one non-spammable CC (Tryndamere, Nocturne, Cait, Mundo, Warwick) and they're still viable picks. In some cases their CC isn't even that good most of the time (Cait). You also have characters who have no CC at all (Yi, Ezreal, Katarina) and even they are viable.

- If you want to tank choose Amumu or Cho.

- If you want DPS choose a ranged AD carry or something.

^For the above 2 points I'm also going to add that you have to find a balance between Tank and DPS (hence the term Tanky DPS =O) that you find most comfortable. I've seen tanky Nocturnes do their job amazingly and I've also seen glass cannon Nocturne rape teams. I have also seen Tanky DPS Nocturnes do very well. You play what suits you and what your team needs, if you don't like it then choose somebody else who suits your playstyle better.

- Passive: perfectly fine as it is, not OP but still useful.

- Q: his Q already has something: 30% armor reduction on all levels. Keep in mind that reduction happens before penetration so it'll shred anybody's armor with its full potential all the time.

- W: while the clone is easy to see coming (no buffs/debuffs visible + mana loss on useage) it could use a little rework (like not having those obvious tells), but other than that its fine as it is. (though a buff won't hurt >_>)

- E: also perfectly fine as is. If you want extra movement speed then build a Trinity Force or get ghost. Adding extra movement speed on the skill will make it too good.

- R: Don't know what can be done about it to make it better (it seems fine to me), but your suggestions make it just plain overpowered. A potential 2 knock-ups aoe ult? Even Alistar has only one knock-up. Dealing all the damage in activation? Removes any need for skill or to actually stick to your opponent as you can just E -> Q -> R and just zoom through all opponents once -> W to escape and come back later for cleanup when your moves are off CD.

Overall, your post has some truth to it, but is also heavy on the QQ side and somewhat biased. It feels like you are comparing him to characters like pre-nerf Jarvan or Irelia without actually playing him the way he should be played. Play smart and adjust to the character. He's slightly on the underpowered side, but he's not that bad.

Just my 2 cents.