Talk:Graves/@comment-4710042-20140926144739/@comment-7095057-20141013222603

Grave's Q and E are both fine where they are. If anything he needs a bit more power in his Q early game, maybe higher bonus AD scaling, but there is no reason it needs to make his Q more poke based, especially on a champ who's spot in ADCs is a burst caster/steriod carry. Riot has some serious focus on what they want champs to fill. Graves seems to be that tanky carry who gets in your face and blows it off, while they went with Lucian being the hyper mobile carry. That said it doesn't make sense for graves Q to be altered in that fashion

There are a few things that should be done to make Lucian a bit more in line (Such as his Light Slinger passive should be 4 seconds instead of 6 to allow more consideration of when he engages instead of sitting on his passive to bully players out), but graves is mostly fine

The only things I think could require touch ups on graves:

-His Q needs a bit more damager/scaling early: At 15 damage increase to 75/110/145/180/215 would give him 135/198/261/324/387 for max damage, which is not overly huge considering resistances. In either case it either needs more scaling or less MP, as it's currently more effective to just auto instead of using it as extra harrass.

-W needs some work for sure, but what I think would be effective is if it had a trailing effect. Sort of a field that applies a debuff that lasts after escaping or ending it. For instance:

Targets that pass through smokescreen have their movement speed and vision obscured as long as they are in the field, and then an additional 2 seconds as they leave it or it disapates. This would give Smokescreen more of a Smook like effect without detracting from it's original use or just adding numbers to it.