Thread:Sagee Prime/@comment-4881935-20121005021354/@comment-3323227-20121005062711

Actually I put it back at the original values till I could get a good handle on how steroids like this are generally treated in the cooldown area. I think a duration of 7 seconds with a 20 second cooldown would be fine. Although all your hate with the cooldowns did you ever think of her current cooldowns? She can get Primal Surge to a 6 second cooldown with a seven second duration on the current one just so you know.

As for healing I don't know where you got the idea that low amounts of damage based healing were a problem. From my experience it is always the type of healing that can be done completely passively that is generally the problem. Examples: High hp regen and burst heals - Mundo and soraka have these types.

Why are these bad and potentially toxic? HP regen is persistant non stop healing and you can do it in and out of combat. There is no real counter play for hp regen other than heal debuffs and heavy burst damage to take out the target quickly.

Burst heals allow you to basically erase damage that was just inflicted in combat or allow you to flee battle and regain a large portion of missing hp while out of combat.

When either of these types of heals are combined with high armor and MR attempting to damage these targets becomes even harder than if they just had one or the other.

The damage to heal is balanced in the way it returns hp and sustains you. You always have to be in combat to get the effect and it doesn't return hp based on raw damage. if you had 100 damage and 15% damage to hp you would not get back the expected 15 hp. If you target had 100 armor for instance and you dealt 100 damage you would only get about 7.5 hp back instead of 15 because your damage was reduced by 50%. 50% of 100 is 50 total damage dealt which translates to only 7.5 hp returned and you only get it if you are doing damage.

The reason I have the shred based on stacks is I don't want Nidalee getting an immediate huge chunk of reduction. lets say i just set it at 20% reduction on all attacks or just abilities with no stacks. I could just hit the whole enemy team and give my entire team bonus damage almost equal to a vlad ult. My intention was to have it high but mostly single target. She has AOE in cougar but you rarely clip more than 1 champion with her AOE. The main thing is I don't want Nidalee to have to build pen for MR and Armor due to half her kit being melee and grabbing items that allow her to survive melee doesn't leave room for pen items. You only see glass cannon AP Nidalee get pen items and all she does is toss Q and runaway. AP Nidalee even gets near and AD carry and she dies very quickly. Lastly like most melee without true gap closer Nidalee gets kited super easy in cougar form. That pounce does not help when you are being slapped with slows and I actually find slows to be the best way to catch and kill nidalee not hard CC like most other champions.

I honestly don't expect anyone to fully understand my state of balance but this isn't all stuff I came up with by myself. I played Nidalee before she was released and she was a much different champion then. After release I played about 3 different versions of Nidalee. AD/Bruiser Nidalee was the first Nidalee despite what people say. It got nerfed because she used to have a 60-280 hp heal with a flat 50 mana cost and her pounce could get down to a 1.8 second cooldown - This made Bruiser Nidalee and Hybrid CDR Nidalee really strong. After these nerfs AP Nidalee became really strong because they buffed heal and javelin ap ratio and missile speed(yes it was even slower).

If you wish to do your own version of the remake and post as a comment then so be it. I have no problem with that. I originally had a reworked based on her old damage resource dripping wound but once i got it together and seen how it worked I realized why they took it out. It worked kinda like darius but it was worse in some cases and broken in others.

As for Vahlderr - Look at it this way. If Nidalee didn't have Primal Surge or Bushwhack she would essentially have 0 utility. A champions value is generally based on what they can do by themselves and what they can do for the team. Some champions are really good solo and mediocre for the team, some are really great with the team but mediocre by themselves, and other kinda fall in between good by themselves and with the team. My aim is for the middle.

So what does Nidalee bring to the team: attackspeed buff for pushing, poking for sieging, and shred for team fights. I'm done for now. gotta get some sleep.