Talk:Warwick/@comment-11138826-20130824182939/@comment-8506165-20131016053751

"He is one of few characters who can move inside jungle all time full hp, so I'd like to know who can counterjungle him so bad to ruin his match"

Shaco says hi. He can get his blue and your red before you're even done with your blue. Assuming he doesn't just wait there to kill you with a nest of boxes. He also has better ganks than you. And does more damage than you.

Wander around the jungle on full HP all you like, Shaco will still take your stuff, do more ganks than you, actually get kills (probably using your red buff) and not generally be useless before hitting six, which'll take you a while if you can't gank anyone due to losing your red. So, Shaco OP? Hardly. Warwick's UP. He has jungle sustain. That's literally it. His clears aren't actually all that fast. His ganks are just laughable pre-6. Post-6, he gets one good gank when his ult's up; better hope it goes well, right?

Sure, Warwick's not so bad as to be unplayable, but to say that he offers as much as Nunu, Udyr, Shyvana, Shaco or any other good counterjunglers you care to name is just ridiculous. I mean, he's practically a walking ultimate, and it's an ultimate that can be countered with, or any enemy teammate with hard CC. He's an entirely single-target guy with practically no utility once his ult's gone and middling damage, particularly seeing as he has to build somewhat tanky to stay relevant even with his sustain. I honestly wouldn't care if he lost enough sustain that he was no longer permanently on full health in the jungle, so long as he just got something to make him more... useful.