Talk:Riven/@comment-5209745-20131204175508/@comment-5489694-20131205225644

What do you do when your opponent starts on the same side of the map as you? i.e You start your blue and they start their red. What happens if they go to your 2nd buff (something I'd do vs Riven) instead of going to their own? What happens if you walk over a ward and can't gank? You're fucked. You can't just say "Hurrr I buy red pot and walk in to the enemy jungle and walk out with a kill every time . Hurrr red pot is totally a good starting item because I was able to kill someone this one  time."

You can't drink your pot until you're fighting someone. You can't farm and get levels safely until you drink your pot because you have next to no bonus stats. You can't just make the $ for red pot back and say it was worth the purchase because you need to make up for the loss of stats when it's buff fades. Drinking a red pot, getting a kill, then buying a long sword means nothing because you could've started with that long sword and it's permanent 10 ad. You need to get 800g for red pot to be worth purchasing as a jungler. Red pot needs to earn you 800g, you can't just farm camps and get 800g ,you need to get 800g from sources you otherwise would not have been able to aqcuire gold from had you not bought red pot.

Red pot and long sword aren't super different. There's next to no difference between "clear speed and safety"; you get 3 pots with either start and the bonus hp from red pot is only useful while fighting someone not running around farming. T he main difference between red pot and long sword is long sword's stats don't have a timer tied to them. Are you trying to say 5 more ad (for 3 minutes) is what makes Red pot a good item to start?

Starting red pot is an unnecessary risk on a champ that's already fairly risky to jungle in the first place. Red pot start is like a "cheese strat" w/o actually being a cheese strat.. it's just bad dude. There's no reason to do it when there's a safer more effective alternative that's equally effective at "walking in to the enemy jungle and walking out with a kill". PS Don't say you do something if you actually don't... -_-