Talk:Riven/@comment-5160958-20140110223848/@comment-9008617-20140112223511

@Leyrann: 

"I prefer Last Whisper over Black Cleaver because it's more armor penetration, even if you apply every stack (at which point that AD carry you're focusing should be dead already), and it's cheaper with nearly as much AD."

This is the age-old LW vs BC debate. LW costs less than BC but that's also because LW doesn't come with bonus health, CDR, 15 more bonus AD, and the armor reduction by BC is abusable by your entire team. In other words, LW is selfish. D:

"Say that you buy LW and Bruta, that's 600 gold more, and you have 15 AD more, equal flat armor penetration, 15% more %penetration (okay, it's penetration instead of reduction, but that doesn't matter THAT much), and 200 health less. In my opinion, that's worth it. (and I would also like to mention that Riven's AoE's, apart from her ult, are pretty small, and you won't be hitting more than one target often, considering you're in the backline with people who all want to stay away from you and will try to not be in melee range of the one you're going for first. On top of that, remember that BC's penetration, different from Last Whisper, is not instant, but you need to use part of your skill rotation already before you actually make use of it)"

Why would you buy LW and just Bruta? Eventually you should be looking at what your complete build is and having just a Bruta seems a waste... And like I said earlier, BC stacks helps your team.

Riven's AoE is just fine since she has to dive into teams anyways to do damage anyways. If Riven hits more than one target then that's a bonus. Teamfights often involve people getting clustered anyways (sometimes not by choice due to CCs).

BC stacks are proc'ed by anything that does damage. Therefore, correct me if I'm wrong, but Riven's Q, W, AA, and hydra passive/active all proc BC stacks...

"And yeah, I'm not a fan of Spirit Visage. I feel like if I only buy one defensive item, and it's not either Warmog's or Guardian Angel, that I don't feel the effect enough. And as you said too, they're nerfing the cooldown reduction from Spirit Visage in the next patch to 10%."

If they're nerfing SV then that means SV was or rather currently still is OP...

Warmog's doesn't seem that great since Riven isn't really much of a health stacker and you didn't care much for the bonus health from BC so the Warmog passive isn't being maximized. Warmog also provides no armor or MR and therefore % hp skills and items (i.e Vayne, Brand, botrk, Liandries, etc) tend to hurt even more. Warmog + Riven's base health is 2962 therefore the Warmog's passive is 29.6 health per 5 seconds plus Riven's base health regen of 14.5 for a total of 44 health per 5 seconds.

Guardian Angel grants 50 more armor than Spirit Visage and a passive that revives you after 4 seconds for 30% of Riven's base HP 1962 which is 589 health every 5 minutes.

For the same gold, Spirit Visage in comparison gives 15 more MR, 400 more health, 20 health regen for a total of 34.5 health per 5 seconds (i.e. only 10 hp/5 less than Warmogs), and 20% CDR that Riot deemed too OP and is apparently planning to nerf. The Spirit Visage passive also stacks multiplicatively with the lifesteal from Hydra/BT and any LS quints.