Talk:Lee Sin/@comment-5763148-20131114013707/@comment-10590654-20131120134658

Yeah okay I get micro, I play Draven Syndra and zed and yeah that's why I said or at least meant that Lee has no real micro, I meant ward-W is more than just W to target location.

Concerning the fall off yeah he doesn't too much, Insec is an initiate or maybe Pseudo-initiate as stonewall says but he isnt good late like idk an amumu. Amumu is percentage health unkillable aoe stun grabbing machine. Next to that lee is okayish only although his E is pretty good. Kick wont stun everyone is why he isn't as good.

Jarvan though I disagree. He is imo very strong. Black Cleaver Q, slow on W,  AS buff E, The knockup is appliable, it's almost instant and 700ish range which is fine, He can ult in and EQ the backline. Or he can counter initiate with it and ult stuff.

To me Jarv is true initiation because of this AOE EQ that is not that hard to place, and because of the Ult. Walling Nasus into an ult and EQing their backline since your are now in range is pretty good IMO.

And ofc his ult is avoidable by most, but still it does annoy a good bunch of champs and depending on who is facing you you use it differently. Ulting Ezreal is stupid ofc, but Ulti an orianna and she is toast.

But yeah you have valid points, Lee doesn't fall off too much if correctly played, aka like the koreans play not NA (at least they did bad early season 3). Still there is better late like Vi or Jarman ( debatable though depending on who he is chosen against).