User blog comment:Zilverdael/Seperate itemsets and why they are good/@comment-5588011-20140618183850/@comment-6281696-20140620155807

Ashe vs lulu: Volley range: 1200 Glitterlance: 950

AA range Ashe: 600 Lulu: 550

How does lulu outrange ashe...

And yup, the idea is that all archetypes of roles get their own itemset.

There isn't anything stopping you from playing Draven indeed. And in fact items have by far the greatest influence on your STATS. However, your mechanics are mostly dependent on your champion and Draven's MECHANICS encourage glass canon STATS. Hence people prefer to play him as a carry because it synergizes better. That does not mean it's impossible to play him in a different role, just doesn't have the same synergy.

Except that jungle items & boots & trinity actually already fullfill part of the defense requirements needed. E.g. Udyr can now get Idunno a Frozen heart because his jungle item already provides a considerable amount of health. Again, make a full tank build with trinity and one with something defensive in trinities place and look at how patheticly low the difference in defense is between the two while his offensive skyrocketed by 1 single item (and before you are a smartass, don't cheat by using say Frozen heart as your only armor item, then replacing that with trinity and claiming his armor sucks. The other 5 items do need to actually be a sensible build... and yes this is taking into account the need for jungle items & boots should you play him in the jungle)

The point most people make when they say it removes choice is that it prevents you from making ANY choice, which isn't true. I assumed you were implying the same. Yes, obviously certain choices get removed, in exchange you get others back. Why would that even be worthwhile bringing up? Obviously that changes if you change the way itemsets work...

As for not being able to build damage items as a tank when your ADC is being bad. Well, that's the whole sodding point, is that genuinly not clear?

@Twice: Trinity is the most effective damage item on it's own assuming you can abuse its proc. In combination with other items it drops off. But on its own it's the most effective (or at least in like the top 3).

Udyr does deal too much damage, though in fairness damage in LoL is quite silly anyway. Either champions do massive amounts or basicly do nothing. Doesn't help that there's also a massive disparity between the defensive stats of each champion.

Diminishing returns DO exist, however they are relative, not absolute. Every point of armor does always adds 1% of your HP to your Effective HP. Say you have a 100 health and 0 armor. 1 point of armor will now add 1 point of health to your effective health. At 0 armor, your next point of armor increases your effective health by 1%. At 100 armor your next point of armor will add 1 health to your current pool of effective health of 200 which is a relative increase of 0.5%. Hence you have diminishing relative returns, however the absolute values do remain the same. THis is also the main reason why bruisers are so dominant because that 6th damage item only gives a relative increase of say 10%, while a damage item in that slot gives an increase of say 50% offensivly.

Sigh, the role of support is strong, support items however are awefull as nearly all of them work by handicapping yourself in return for some extra utility. E.g. you don't take sighstone because you want health and wish to be usefull to your team at the same time but because you need wards and don't have any real choice in the matter. By comparison, locket you do take because you want to getsome MR and you prefer locket over say banshees because locket helps your team and banshees doesn't.

Having both IBG & sunfire is insanely expensive, also those aren't support items, they're tank items. Further indicating how abysmall support itemization is. As for the 10% thing, the point is that it's ridiculous to ONLY be able to win a fight when you can can kill the guy in one go, as opposed to other situations where you have significant advantages. E.g. I've seen bruisers destroy towers while a tank was going all out on them in an effort to chase them off and in the end both tower & support die with minimum effort. Which is stupid.

The issue is that tanks are weak (or bruisers strong, depending on how you want to view it) because tanks don't get to have a stat advantage over bruisers that matter and on top of that have utterly nonexistant damage with full tank builds. You can give all the tanks different mechanics, which would help. But that'd require you to rework all the sodding tanks. Or you can change itemization to allow tanks to actually have an advantage. Either would be a massive operation and both would have similar effects in the end (and run into pretty much the same complaints actually)