Talk:Gragas/@comment-2257477-20111002022557/@comment-4105539-20111009060738

OK, that is fair. I suppose the words "naturally tanky" is not as properly descriptive as "natural high survivability". At level 18 A Cho with full stacks will have 774 more health and 17 more armor than a level 18 Gragas (although Gragas will reduce all incoming Magic and Physical damage by 18%).

The difference being that as you said, Gragas can Body Slam away from enemies and through walls, and Ult multiple enemies away from him. Cho only has a delayed knock up and a silence, and at full stacks is a much larger target for skill shots. Cho also needs to get quite close for 3 of his 4 abilities, whereas Gragas only needs to do so for one. On top of all this, Gragas' Tankliness is only on the condition that he can channel for 1 second every 20 seconds, whereas Cho needs to get 6 stacks of his ultimate and then not die, or he will lose them.

So Gragas has better "natural survivability". A full AP cho will also outburst a Gragas, but there you come to the problem that you have built no extra survivability on a close range champion who's natural survivability is dependent on not dying. Its why I personally don't think pure AP Cho is a smart way to build him.

tl;dr Gragas has more "natural survivability", and doesn't need to build as tanky to be effective, so in a normal situation against competent enemies will burst for more.