Talk:Vayne/@comment-3546228-20151012015758/@comment-5955640-20151012023828

Those marksmen were not all in their prime at the same time.

When Draven was good I don't believe Lucian was around, When Corki and Graves were good Lucian and Draven weren't around (I think Draven just arrived by the end of Season 2) and when Lucian was good none of them and espescially Graves was in his prime and all throughout that Vayne would pop in and out during the moments where these champs were either doing well or not doing much of anything.

Corki is fine, his greatest enemy is really the pre-level six laning phase. A lot of supports have to protect him or enable him but from what I can tell people have forgotten how to play Corki.

Draven is fine. The loss of his passive was years ago and they've buffed it since then. Let him farm and give him a Blitzcrank or a Leona and he bullies his way to victory every time. It even happened in the pro match as one of the more surprise picks.

Vayne being able to outtrade Lucian is the failure of Lucian players. Piercing Light outranges Vayne and a Tumble from the max harass distance of Piercing Light doesn't enter Lucian's attack range. Lucian does however have less of an attack range than Vayne so Lucian has to make sure she doesn't poke him with tumble and that when she enters range he has light slinger after having poked her with Piercing Light.

Ideally Lucian should have a poke support like Lulu or a mobility support like Janna both of which can put shields on to make that sort of trade more than surviable and completely in Lucians favor. The only real obstacle is who the enemy support is. Graves hasn't been good in years. That brief moment of him being good was courtesy of Lucian nerfs. But having said that. Post level six if he has a blitzcrank and he lands a grab he'll still blow his target to hell. That has always worked.

There are changes coming up for marksmen and a nerf facing Vayne so I imagine something of interest will happen.