Talk:Taric/@comment-24971427-20190717091424/@comment-29964258-20190815034611

So as a Taric main, with quite a bit of practice I'm gonna pick across these points. As of earlier today in patch 1.16, I was doing damage to minions with passive. The numbers might not show if you execute with relic shield, but it is doing damage.

(totally read juggersupport as junglersupport and didn't bat an eye)

Given that taric's passive has base damage and doubles attack speed, it makes it as good as or better than the 40% AP on-hit for a decent chunk of the game, although morde's Circle of death beats out taric's passive at all stages of the game.

As for the W... uh yeah pretty much. "lower cooldown" is a little iffy BC of taric's passive, but I do dislike it scaling off target's health. (also guardian cares whether you target someone or whether you self-cast and it auto-casts on your bastion buddy which is dumb because thresh gets to guard people on his auto-targetted shield which is always auto-target).

E I'd argue taric stun is in general more reliable, and it does have a lower CD early, but it does fall short in the other areas.

So ideally the R is used as the enemy commits. I'm saying, "oh look the malph is flying towards us, press R" any earlier, and they just back off until it ends. any later and it might not last long enough. If your team won't survive that long, a locket can help. I do like the idea of a speed boost in there.

yeah, currently his only setup is his E's stun, which lasts long enough to reach them, maybe get one attack.

The idea behind these changes is good (although his passive doubles attack speed, so it doesn't really need more armor scaling) i do think his gimmick is what makes him interesting, he'd be way less useful as a support if he had to be near allies to support and foes to cast abilities to support.

His R should absolutely give speed, because it's his ult, it should totally make him able to use his passive.

Also, E is very reliable in close quarters, as the stun can actually stun people right behind you, so standing on top of them is a guarenteed stun.

So what I think is that they kinda did the same thing to taric that they admitted they did to lissandra when she had the free spell. "oh lissandra has free spells, lets make them all cost more so that it all cancels out" and then lissandra basically didn't have a passive (so they reworked it). They looked at taric's CD reduction on his passive and went "lets make his cooldowns longer, and balance them for having 3-4 seconds off the base cooldown... but to be safe, since it can be more, lets make them weak for that CD" and taric's passive then just made him hit faster and harder, as well as make his spells the strength that they were balanced around. Sure, rito should respect his passive, but they are balancing around the best-case of "Taric is able to do the wocka-wocka" without actually giving him a way to do it. I often end up buying IBG just to slow people to stick to them.