Talk:Garen/@comment-89.171.250.145-20120821195040/@comment-213.114.38.51-20120822160951

If you did the math and say it's a buff you're wrong.

He's more durable now, His Judgement does more damage without items and his Q does a bit more damage over all but just with an IE and 2 dorans blades you do about 1500 less damage including crits (on an average) with the new judgement which is a pretty huge nerf.

His early game is worse simply because his silence is shorter so he can't lane against strong laners such as riven properly anymore.

They basically made him a cone that deals no damage. Sure he's tankier but who gives a shit, he has no proper cc and sucks as any form of tank.

Then they put the slow remove thing on Q instead of E so now you cant use Q to run away faster from enemies, and then if slowed, cleanse it. Now you have to wait until you're slowed to start running fast which basically makes you easier to chase down.

The biggest thing though is the huge damage nerf on E. Sure the Q does about 200 damage more with those same items but it's not comparable to 1500 less. If you're going to try to calculate these again remember that 1. It can and could always crit. 2. It's total AD now, compared to bonus AD which they said would buff his late game but it really didn't because the ratios aren't even close.