Talk:Elise/@comment-4636093-20121209192210/@comment-58.106.232.45-20121213125425

Ur statement about Elise being an Anti-Kayle is overrated. It all comes down to the player's style and preference. Both are versatile in their own way. But the difference comes in their skill kit and scaling ratios. Elise has strong bursts and slightly longer range than Kayle. That is the advantage she has over her. Kayle has consistency in both damage and overall performance.

Neither Elise not Kayle can go as a full Tank. They can only Offtank at best. Let me clear up some terms for you. A generic 'Fighter' is divided into 2 types: Bruiser or Offtank. Bruiser focuses more on aggression while Offtank focuses more on defensive play. Every Fighter champ has a preference for one or the other. In this case, Champs like Elise and Kayle are played like Bruisers while Mundo and Singed are played as Offtanks. The factors which sub-divide Fighters are based on their scaling statistics and their skill kit.

Now moving back to the main point. Elise cannot Tank cos if she does, she will lack any form of genuine damage except in her Q and if she just focuses on that, she will be useless. It'll be like playing a completely nerfed version of Garen. Not to mention she lacks multiple CC to even take on the role of a Tank (Cmon. 1 stun ain't gunna make ya useful).

Elise can't Support either. As stated by OzzyrD, She only has 1 CC skill and it has a long cooldown. The rest of her skills focus on helping HER kill, not her team mate. Kayle can Support naturally cos her Q if placed at level one will only do minor damage and slow the target down for 4 seconds for a solid 35%. Her W, at early levels act as an excellent Heal (Later at late game too if you gear for it) and can also help in escapes and quick chases. Her E helps her carry farm as well. Just by doin some short bursts of damage to minion waves, you can help ur carry farm up faster and even ward off harrasers from even touchin ur carry from a good distance.

Elise's kit doesn't help her in the Support area. Don't even think of doin Support with her. Just a waste of time.

Another issue with Elise is that she is one of the rare Shifter Champions. Therefore, in most cases, she can only specialise in one form. This applied to Jayce too when he came out cos he can only be either a Caster or a Carry. Now the itemisation variety is shrunken down mostly to the Magic category and even then it's further shrunken down by the fact that you must learn to specialise in one of the 2 forms.

It is possible to use both forms with proper configurations but that requires your own genuine playstyle. Kayle has no issue in which Shifter types have. You can consider Kayle to be a prototype Shifter since Kayle was the very first Champion in LoL to have access to both Melee AND Range.

Elise CANNOT build with AD. It'll be a complete waste of her skill kit. Build AP items or gears that augment AP but do not build AD, ever. Most AD gears only give Damage and some sub statistics which augment its use. AP doesn't just give out the things I've stated. Most of them give a variety of utility which help AP types. AD Items rarely have special utility boosts.

Oh and for your information, the only main reason to why Kayle is a good pick is cos of 3 reasons:

-She has no solid counterpicks. You thought Elise was a counter? Think again. Other Champs give Kayle more trouble than Elise. Yorick, Nasus and even Malphite. But even these guys cannot fully counter her cos she always has a way of preventing them from tipping things to their favour.

-She is able to adjust on the fly. Which is rare for an Alpha Champion.

-She can fit into many different team compositions even without the right runes and masteries for them.

The main reason to why Kayle has a disadvantage early game is cos she is gear dependant. The more flexible and versatile a Champion, the more gear dependant they are. Kayle needs at least an item or 2 to really get her game on. Elise doesn't since she has a niche scaling on her Q and her base damage is still solid. Kayle on the other hand requires more tuning to get her rhythm. But once she returns to base and comes back, you ain't got much chance if the guy is around your skill or higher.

I speak this cos I know Kayle inside n out. Trust me on this.