Talk:Taric/@comment-125.60.241.233-20120616131504/@comment-4659726-20120622001847

^ Firstly, when the carry isn't there I am good about taking CS that would have died anyway. Thats basics of support. Though a good support shouldn't let the carry die.

Secondly, if you think supports sit back and do nothing. You are doing it wrong. Supports are very much engaging to play and probably make or break the lane more than that carry who has to spend 30 minutes farming. Warding, counter warding, ranged harass if able, keeping the carry alive, making calls on when dragon or baron is safe, keeping an eye on where everybody is on the map, and so on.

Third, Yes items matter that much for carries. They build glass cannon to deal damage and a lot of it. And your team's job is to not let enemies jump on the carry. And I know for a fact giving money that could have been used to give the carry a little edge to the support is bad. If I got AP for Janna? Doesn't matter, they would still die if you let the enemy attack them because shields scale off of resists better than they do AP. Ap for soraka? Other support items are more important and your W should cover most problems.

Getting a significant amount of Ap is just not useful as a traditional support bot, it costs too much and you could have afforded an Aegis/Locket/Shurelia's. CDR on Janna and soraka comes from Ionian boots, it should be more than enough since shurelia's (a first rush item b/c of teamfights) also gives CDR.

What I find most irritating is that idea that supports are "on the bench" when in reality supports and good support play can often mean the difference between winning a teamfight or losing it. This is even more true for supports like Janna who have a lot of disruption. I personally think unconventional supports should be limited to tank type supports because the support role is a unique and interesting role. They are some of the few types of characters that don't focus on "tons of damage" and instead focus on "win the game".

Also, Mobafire guides suck. Taking an example from the site, the top rated Graves and Kog'maw guides. Graves only gets one Doran's sword and gets it first (depends on your support and is not an absolute), and Kogmaw gets wriggles? what? Standard Carry usually gets Boots double dorans with boots if shield support and dorans if healing support. They go on to get BF/IE > zeal > BF/IE(whichever you don't have) > PD > LW > Situational last item being QSS/GA usually or...I'm so far ahead I'll build whatever and win lolol.

And generally good positioning > building survivability that should come from the other champions blocking access to the carry. If you are melting instantly, you and your team are doing it wrong. Really the best defense if the enemy team is CC heavy is QSS for carries. But again, having that completed damage item does make a difference. This comes from loads of playing bot lane as the support.