Talk:Garen/@comment-15020375-20140217212613/@comment-15244341-20140314091554

I've never intended to say Decesive Strike is a bad gapcloser in lane. Or in skirmishes in the jungle when Garen just appears from behind a corner. All I meant was looking at full scale late game teamfights. And no, supports are not weak. I don't mean to say they will kill Garen, but that the will peel Garen off their ADC (number one priority). Both Lulu and Thresh, the most problematic ones, can just chain CC with their really strong slows to keep Garen out of the backline. This is not actually that hard to do, since Garen is a pretty obvious target to see coming.

Renekton, again, loses lane vs Garen. I'll not call it an automatically lost lane for Renekton, but he is definitely playing catch up with him. This is something we both agree with.

And Mundo doesn't want to kill you in lane four times, take tower and then roam (like, say... Garen). He wants to farm, get fat and then dominate in teamfights, which is his whole job. He can poke like a boss with cleaver, is actually a bad target for Demacian Justice since Mundo, when playing carefully and not going ham, can pretty much stay in lane as long as he wants since his ult's cooldown is neglegible and he can pretty much heal to be out of "I can get a kill with Demacian Justice if I dive him" threshold. He is very like Nasus. Except he is actually hard to kill since he will focus on HP regen and being as meaty as humanly possible.

And I agree. Garen wants the enemy team to focus him and if you manage, then you basically win the teamfight. But I didn't say that the enemy team should ignore him. They should, however, make him waste his skills. Say you charge with Decesive strike. Then Thresh ults to stop you. What now? You either go for Thresh (not a terrible call, not a great one) or enemy's frontline. Which is not a good plan since Garen is not going to kill most tanky characters late game.

And again, yes, Renekton sees play because he is realiable in lane and safe to pick. Same with the (now not that popular) Orianna and Zed pickups. The just couldn't really lose lane because they had a way to get farmed enough to matter when midgame came, even if they couldn't go for a kill. Renekton can actually proxy and farm all day, then become a sack of health and resistances late game whose damage is not that great but can be applied somewhat reliably.

PD: Garen was my first champion too and the one that got me into top lane so I share the Garen love with you. However, I like to be objective and I do understand that when the game goes past the 25 minute mark Garen is going to start to suffer from his lack of gapclosers. Also, goddam Lulu should have stayed sleeper OP forever. That Yordle is so damn annoying to play against...